Amitay: [00:00:00] If you minimize oxidative stress [00:00:02] in your skin, you're gonna get better [00:00:04] responses. As far as like UV radiation, [00:00:06] old skin equals old brain. Old skin [00:00:08] equals a brain that is being [00:00:10] inflamed. Not only an older brain, [00:00:12] but a brain that actually ages the body. [00:00:14] I have artificial light on me. [00:00:16] These lights [00:00:18] actually lower the energy [00:00:20] production of my skin cells, [00:00:22] so they lower 80 50.
See like a lot of [00:00:24] people now saying, oh, the sun is like [00:00:26] 80% of why your skin is aging. That [00:00:28] is not only not [00:00:30] true. If you look at [00:00:32] correctly correlated [00:00:34] studies as far as like how we live our [00:00:36] life, 60% of why you [00:00:38] age is because of environmental factors that [00:00:40] are non uv.
Dave: A lot of our [00:00:42] allergic triggers are from leaky skin [00:00:44] barrier and using a good quality [00:00:46] skincare seals the barrier.
What are the [00:00:48] things that I should be looking [00:00:50] for in the topicals that [00:00:52] I use? [00:00:54] You are listening to the Human Upgrade with [00:00:56] Dave aspr.[00:00:58] [00:01:00]
It's so fun [00:01:02] to talk with you because [00:01:04] you're also a biohacker and you [00:01:06] have this, well, you know, I'm [00:01:08] technical. And then I started working [00:01:10] with lasers and light and [00:01:12] radio frequency stuff. And then you started working with [00:01:14] longevity compounds on the skin [00:01:16] and most of the [00:01:18] biohacking world, [00:01:20] they kind of missed how important the [00:01:22] skin is as an organ [00:01:24] and as a way to get substances [00:01:26] into the body.
And the stuff you're doing [00:01:28] at Young Goose is really interesting [00:01:30] because you have a different frame [00:01:32] on beauty as we have your biohacking [00:01:34] beauty show. I've heard you [00:01:36] say that a lot of anti-aging [00:01:38] treatments actually age your skin. [00:01:40] Why?
Amitay: First of all, it really [00:01:42] depends on who you are and how you, [00:01:44] uh, you know, how, how you [00:01:46] show up to that treatment.
So if you [00:01:48] are the Tom Brady or the [00:01:50] Dave Asprey of [00:01:52] youthful function, you can get away [00:01:54] with a lot of things. But [00:01:56] 99.9% of people [00:01:58] aren't. And most [00:02:00] beauty treatments, anti-aging [00:02:02] treatments, as far as like the skin is concerned, [00:02:04] are very [00:02:06] rudimentary in the way that they provide [00:02:08] results, which is stimulation of [00:02:10] repair through control damage.[00:02:12]
And the problem is, is [00:02:14] that, is, that is injury that your body [00:02:16] needs to deal with. If it deals [00:02:18] with it like a 50-year-old body, [00:02:20] you're gonna get a lot of anything [00:02:22] from scar tissue formation [00:02:24] to, you know, before that we talked about [00:02:26] adhesion between parts. That's one thing that [00:02:28] happens. But you could think of [00:02:30] collagen and elastin production, which I think that's [00:02:32] what a lot of people [00:02:34] imagine to themselves.
[00:02:36] Treatments are. As a [00:02:38] response for [00:02:40] trauma that is based on [00:02:42] scar tissue for men, not, not based [00:02:44] on some kind of, uh, axis [00:02:46] of our youthful function and [00:02:48] ex and, and rewinding of our, [00:02:50] of our youthful state.
Dave: [00:02:52] Okay. So people in their [00:02:54] forties or fifties don't [00:02:56] heal from injuries very well. So [00:02:58] you're saying the longevity treatments that are like [00:03:00] sanding your skin, you're not gonna heal because [00:03:02] your body's not in a state to heal
Amitay: [00:03:04] sanding your skin is.
Oh, [00:03:06] definitely. But that is, that is, [00:03:08] uh, I think the. The [00:03:10] kind of the imaginary situation. 'cause no [00:03:12] one actually goes ahead and sand the [00:03:14] skin. But things for [00:03:16] example, like radio frequency, like [00:03:18] al ultrasound, high frequency [00:03:20] ultrasound mm-hmm. These things [00:03:22] go into a very, very deep tissue. [00:03:24] Technically speaking, they actually try and [00:03:26] target your fascia just a side [00:03:28] discussion.
But what they are trying [00:03:30] to do is to [00:03:32] create a reaction of a, [00:03:34] of that, that a youthful skin would do. Mm-hmm. [00:03:36] Which is heal perfectly, but what [00:03:38] you get really is basically [00:03:40] scar tissue you're getting. Yeah. And, and it's [00:03:42] not even in a skin level, it's a much deeper [00:03:44] level. Even things like your blood [00:03:46] vessels or your fat do not react [00:03:48] very well to those things.
Dave: So you're [00:03:50] saying people who are doing these, [00:03:52] these radiofrequency aging [00:03:54] treatments are actually creating deep [00:03:56] scarring in the fascia. [00:03:58] That
Amitay: is, by the way, any [00:04:00] plastic surgeon mm-hmm. That is dealing [00:04:02] with facial plastics is going to [00:04:04] tell you this, that this is a harder patient to [00:04:06] deal with. We can also talk about [00:04:08] things that are more cell on a cellular [00:04:10] level, which are things like, you know, [00:04:12] shortening your telomeres
Dave: mm-hmm.
Amitay: [00:04:14] Or anything you, anything [00:04:16] that we do that [00:04:18] asks your tissue to [00:04:20] regenerate faster than it is [00:04:22] capable of. Yeah. [00:04:24] You're depleting your calling [00:04:26] on future reservoirs. [00:04:28] Mm-hmm. You're calling on what your body [00:04:30] has kinda left for your future, so [00:04:32] you're, you're borrowing reservoir [00:04:34] reservoirs that you're not gonna have later on, [00:04:36] if that makes sense.
By the way, even in [00:04:38] skincare, we can [00:04:40] see. We can see the [00:04:42] results of that because [00:04:44] conventional [00:04:46] medical grade skincare brands [00:04:48] that still, we have [00:04:50] some biohackers that are using because [00:04:52] they kind of don't know better. They [00:04:54] got, they're drinking that Kool-Aid [00:04:56] still are [00:04:58] really concentrating on the [00:05:00] stimulatory aspect without [00:05:02] any support of be useful function.
Dave: [00:05:04] It's funny, uh, I've [00:05:06] been, I've been out there for a long time [00:05:08] saying training [00:05:10] harder isn't going to [00:05:12] get you results. Mm-hmm. Unless [00:05:14] you're replenished ahead of time and you [00:05:16] recover as fast as a [00:05:18] stimulation. Yeah. So you're kind of saying that people are [00:05:20] just overstimulating and not [00:05:22] recovering their skin.
Okay. [00:05:24] What does skin recovery look like? [00:05:26] Well,
Amitay: it depends of, first of all, on your [00:05:28] age, but mainly skin recovery. [00:05:30] It starts with sleep. I. [00:05:32] Okay. It continues with [00:05:34] blood circulation. So these are the two [00:05:36] tenants really, you know, making sure that you [00:05:38] like exercise, right? Mm-hmm. Making sure that there [00:05:40] is, that, that there are building [00:05:42] blocks that come with your blood supply.
Dave: Mm-hmm.
Amitay: [00:05:44] And that you have enough time to recover, which [00:05:46] happens at night. Uh, we can talk [00:05:48] about, you know, further later, but [00:05:50] basically your body doesn't [00:05:52] recover or [00:05:54] respond very well when you're awake. It [00:05:56] just tries to kind of survive [00:05:58] until it, it's [00:06:00] nighttime or until you sleep. Okay? So these are [00:06:02] the two tenets.
If you're [00:06:04] older and you cannot access, you know, [00:06:06] your, your, the [00:06:08] right epigenetic [00:06:10] responses, uh, like collagen production, elastin [00:06:12] production, hyaluronic acid production, but [00:06:14] many other things like [00:06:16] LUM as a cool gene. [00:06:18] Then you won't even [00:06:20] respond well if you had all the [00:06:22] sleep possible. So you really need to make [00:06:24] sure youthful function is an issue [00:06:26] and then how do I support it through [00:06:28] lifestyle.
Dave: Okay. So let's say [00:06:30] someone's serious about their skin [00:06:32] and they say, all right, I'm gonna [00:06:34] make a commitment to go to [00:06:36] sleep on time. And by the way, [00:06:38] guys go to sleep with [00:06:40] dave.com. Best URL of my entire life. Mm-hmm. [00:06:42] And it's free. And it's just [00:06:44] all the stuff that I know about how to get better [00:06:46] sleep. And, and I've been really focused on [00:06:48] this for 17 years.
I've been tracking my [00:06:50] sleep. Mm-hmm. And you can really shift it. [00:06:52] So go there and get some sleep. [00:06:54] But I, I'll also [00:06:56] admit this I'm a dude, [00:06:58] I don't really want to [00:07:00] put a bunch of stuff on my face. Yeah. [00:07:02] And about eight, nine years [00:07:04] ago, just studying skin barrier [00:07:06] function skin, I'm realizing this is actually something [00:07:08] that I want to do.
So before I [00:07:10] go to bed, I do put things on my [00:07:12] face, including Young Goose, [00:07:14] and it makes a really big [00:07:16] difference. What are the things [00:07:18] that I should be looking for [00:07:20] in the topicals that I use? Like, [00:07:22] what? What's in there?
Amitay: So I [00:07:24] think, most of the time you're, [00:07:26] you're sold to panacea. Most of the time. There's [00:07:28] this one ingredient that a company, you know, [00:07:30] has at least built some kind of, um, [00:07:32] framework around saying that they have this [00:07:34] ingredient no one else has, and that would solve [00:07:36] all your problems.
So the truth to the [00:07:38] matter is there is no panacea, but there are a few [00:07:40] things that you want to pay attention to. Okay. The [00:07:42] first is youthful energy, or, or [00:07:44] basically we can think of NAD as the MO [00:07:46] molecule that kind of leads that. Mm-hmm. [00:07:48] But youthful energy in general could [00:07:50] be just good mitochondrial function.
So we need [00:07:52] to Wow.
Dave: Yeah. Okay. Sorry I didn't [00:07:54] interrupt. Like everything comes outta [00:07:56] mitochondria. That's basically the whole, the whole [00:07:58] central point of, of [00:08:00] biohacking Yeah. Is make the mitochondria work and you can [00:08:02] be more conscious, your skin works better, your liver, [00:08:04] everything. Mm-hmm. So NAD [00:08:06] topically is part of what young goose is doing.
Yeah.
Amitay: And [00:08:08] by the way, you could also a [00:08:10] side, side note from like [00:08:12] just skin topicals within [00:08:14] the mitochondrial discussion. I think that things [00:08:16] that you ingest orally, like, [00:08:18] tyl choline would help. Tremendously as [00:08:20] well. Mm-hmm. Just like a side note, but youthful [00:08:22] energy is one area. Okay. The [00:08:24] second area is kind of [00:08:26] removal of waste.
So if you think of a [00:08:28] city mm-hmm. Obviously the city needs, needs to [00:08:30] run on energy to function well, [00:08:32] but you also need someone to clear the [00:08:34] trash every day. The senescent cells, [00:08:36] senescent cells are a type of trash. [00:08:38] Mm-hmm. But you have many other types of [00:08:40] trash, like, you know, cellular parts [00:08:42] that are not functioning correctly, [00:08:44] or, uh, proteins that have been [00:08:46] misfolded, for example.
So [00:08:48] we, the best way to do that, the most [00:08:50] all encompassing way is through [00:08:52] autophagy. Mm-hmm. And there is a [00:08:54] trick here because even though I refer [00:08:56] to something that could work from the inside [00:08:58] out, within autophagy, it's an issue [00:09:00] because in order to trigger [00:09:02] autophagy, we. Are [00:09:04] lowering our calorie count, basically.
Mm-hmm. [00:09:06] Or we're minimizing the time that we [00:09:08] ingest calories.
Dave: Yeah. So intermittent [00:09:10] fasting is a huge way to increase [00:09:12] autophagy. Yes. And there are some [00:09:14] natural compounds that do it as well though.
Amitay: Yes. [00:09:16] Correct. And so the natural compounds, [00:09:18] especially if you apply them on the skin, they kind of [00:09:20] bypass the fact that you might close facial [00:09:22] fat if you just lost weight, which I know is [00:09:24] something you've, you've spoken about recently.
Yeah. [00:09:26] Being a 6% body fat is not good for your [00:09:28] face. Exactly. So, for example, [00:09:30] sperming and especially sperm, [00:09:32] like full spectrum sperming [00:09:34] sperming, and its pre and [00:09:36] post cursors. Okay. Per mean [00:09:38] and Racine mm-hmm. [00:09:40] Are these amazing compounds [00:09:42] that together don't only [00:09:44] trigger autophagy, they're [00:09:46] actually, they're needed in [00:09:48] order for your genes to express [00:09:50] autophagy.
Mm-hmm. So even if you fasted [00:09:52] like crazy. If you [00:09:54] don't have enough Sperming, sperm and [00:09:56] reine, you're not going to have [00:09:58] proper autophagy.
Dave: So you have all of [00:10:00] those in Young Goose. Yeah, and [00:10:02] this is kind of funny because. If [00:10:04] you look at ammonia formation, which is [00:10:06] related to these things. Mm-hmm. If you eat way [00:10:08] too much protein, or maybe you eat enough [00:10:10] protein, but you can't digest it because your stomach acid [00:10:12] doesn't work, then it kind of [00:10:14] spoils in the gut.
And reine was discovered [00:10:16] in spoiling meat.
Amitay: Mm-hmm. And
Dave: I [00:10:18] was like, oh, we don't want that. In fact, in [00:10:20] the very, very early days of figuring [00:10:22] out all this stuff in the Bulletproof Diet, like, well, we [00:10:24] don't want these biogenic Emmys in our [00:10:26] gut, but it turns out sperm dine is one you [00:10:28] want. Yeah. And too much [00:10:30] Racine in the gut is not a good thing because it [00:10:32] means basically your food spoiling.
Mm-hmm. Which if it's [00:10:34] spoiling, you have a problem with digestion.
Amitay: Yeah.
Dave: [00:10:36] But when you have adequate [00:10:38] amounts of this, it turns out that's another [00:10:40] longevity compound. Very similar [00:10:42] to what Sperming does, but no one talks about it. [00:10:44] Mm-hmm. You guys are actually using it in a [00:10:46] supplement on the skin.
Amitay: Yeah.
Dave: Does it affect [00:10:48] me systemically if I put it on my skin?
Amitay: [00:10:50] Yes and no. Okay. So [00:10:52] not in a way that you would think, [00:10:54] although we have discovered in a [00:10:56] trial we're running now, that because we're [00:10:58] supplementing the skin with NAD [00:11:00] precursors and allowing the skin to actually [00:11:02] recycle its own NAD, which is a different story, [00:11:04] it does affect it systemically. [00:11:06] But to answer your question, [00:11:08] you are not gonna get better [00:11:10] autophagy throughout your body because you're triggering [00:11:12] autophagy in the skin.
But [00:11:14] there is a really, really cool couple [00:11:16] studies coming out of Portugal [00:11:18] that shows that senescent cells in your [00:11:20] skin can [00:11:22] actually hijack your [00:11:24] skin brain axis [00:11:26] and age your brain [00:11:28] through this. Really, this is new info to [00:11:30] me. Yeah, I, I'll send you the study, but it's through [00:11:32] the HP axi. So you have anxi that is [00:11:34] responsible for your kind of [00:11:36] stress responses in the body, [00:11:38] and it's, it's directly linked to your [00:11:40] skin.
So old skin equals old brain. [00:11:42] Old skin equals a [00:11:44] brain that is being inflamed, not [00:11:46] only an older brain, but a brain that, [00:11:48] that actually ages the body in return. Okay. [00:11:50] How old are you? I'm almost [00:11:52] 39.
Dave: Almost 39. Yeah. Your skin [00:11:54] looks ridiculous, especially under your eyes. Yeah. [00:11:56] Uh, what do you do to it?
Amitay: First [00:11:58] of all, sleep.
I think for, if you're talking [00:12:00] about the eyes, the sleep is the number one [00:12:02] issue. But I do very simple [00:12:04] things. I wash my face only once a day, [00:12:06] and that's at, that's at night. I don't wash it in [00:12:08] the morning. I make [00:12:10] sure that the sun that I am exposed to [00:12:12] is kind of before [00:12:14] zenith of the, of the sun to the earth.
So [00:12:16] basically like until 10:00 PM or after 4:00 [00:12:18] PM I use zinc [00:12:20] oxide as my sunblock. That's [00:12:22] a side note, because if you look [00:12:24] at real research, and I see like a lot of people [00:12:26] now saying, oh, the sun is like 80% [00:12:28] of why your skin is aging. I. [00:12:30] That is not only not [00:12:32] true, the, if you [00:12:34] look at correctly [00:12:36] correlated studies as far as [00:12:38] like how we live our life mm-hmm.[00:12:40]
You are 60% [00:12:42] of why you age is because of [00:12:44] environmental factors that are non uv. [00:12:46] So non-native EMFs [00:12:48] pollution, heavy metals, [00:12:50] artificial blue light. Mm-hmm. [00:12:52] Um, so these are things that I try to [00:12:54] avoid as much as possible, but I use [00:12:56] compounds that mitigate [00:12:58] those interactions with [00:13:00] my skin. Ecto is like a, [00:13:02] a great example, which, which is an [00:13:04] ingredient that does that [00:13:06] ect.
Yeah. What's that from? ECT [00:13:08] is from a bacteria. Okay. It's from [00:13:10] Extre lights. So if anyone goes to like [00:13:12] Yellowstone and they see beautiful [00:13:14] colors around the ponds, that's from that, [00:13:16] that's from that type of [00:13:18] bacteria. And they all, they're also called [00:13:20] space steady bears because mm-hmm. Allegedly they [00:13:22] can survive on the outside of the tardigrades.
[00:13:24] Yes, exactly. Okay. So tardigrades [00:13:26] have this really, really cool [00:13:28] protein that structures [00:13:30] water around protein. Mm. [00:13:32] So it actually [00:13:34] provides a structure that [00:13:36] doesn't let proteins degrade as [00:13:38] much. Wow. A [00:13:40] really cool, I call it the, any, [00:13:42] everything that hyaluronic acid wish [00:13:44] it were,
Dave: I did not know you [00:13:46] had tardigrade juice [00:13:48] available.
Okay. And [00:13:50] the fact that it works by structuring water, [00:13:52] um. Years [00:13:54] ago, I had this idea to put [00:13:56] butter and MCT oil in water. [00:13:58] Oh, actually coffee. I mean, who would've imagined? [00:14:00] Right. And it drove me [00:14:02] insane that I had to blend. It was called [00:14:04] Bulletproof Coffee back then. Um, today I'm no [00:14:06] longer with Bulletproof and I put butter and [00:14:08] mc in my danger coffee that all has minerals and [00:14:10] is mold tested, blah, blah, blah.
[00:14:12] But it drove me nuts. I couldn't eat [00:14:14] butter and drink coffee. It does not work, [00:14:16] and it should work [00:14:18] well. The reason is that you have to blend [00:14:20] it. Mm-hmm. And so I, I did some [00:14:22] research. I paid for it at the University of [00:14:24] Washington with Dr. Gerald Pollock, and he [00:14:26] has proven that this kind of structured water we're [00:14:28] talking about, this isn't like the woo [00:14:30] woo quantum water.
And that may be real. Actually, I [00:14:32] have a, a wand that makes water taste [00:14:34] different. There's something going on there, but structured [00:14:36] water is something that happens [00:14:38] when water normally [00:14:40] comes in contact with fat. [00:14:42] And the two kinds of fat that raise [00:14:44] structuring of water the most [00:14:46] is. Butter oil and MCT [00:14:48] oil, and we prove this in studies.
You can [00:14:50] see it on a microscope. This is not wishful thinking [00:14:52] water. This is very real. And cells [00:14:54] can't make a TP or fold proteins. [00:14:56] And you have a magic protein that's better [00:14:58] than MCT oil and butter [00:15:00] oil at making structured water in the [00:15:02] skin. Actually, there is a
Amitay: [00:15:04] what? Yeah, there's actually better [00:15:06] magic, by the way.
Okay. It's called red [00:15:08] light therapy. Oh yeah, I kind of know about that. [00:15:10] Yeah. Maybe started a company a dozen years ago in that space. [00:15:12] Yes. Okay. So, uh, one of the [00:15:14] more woo woo things that are less [00:15:16] that the burden of evidence is still, you know. [00:15:18] There, but [00:15:20] something I truly believe in is [00:15:22] that red light therapy can structure [00:15:24] water.
Oh,
Dave: that's, well [00:15:26] infrared certainly structures it. Yes. Red [00:15:28] may,
Amitay: yes. Well, when, [00:15:30] okay, let me preface, when, when we say red light [00:15:32] therapy, we mean like red and near infrared. Yeah. [00:15:34] Which are wavelengths that are,
Dave: [00:15:36] Joel Pollock will tell you very specifically, it [00:15:38] does structure water and he knows exactly the [00:15:40] frequencies.
So I would say there's science [00:15:42] behind that.
Amitay: I agree with you. Okay. And with [00:15:44] him. And one really cool [00:15:46] thing that, oh, I'll, I'll give you two cool things that it [00:15:48] does. One thing is structures water in the [00:15:50] mitochondria and you have a little like [00:15:52] a turbine in your mitochondria [00:15:54] that spits out energy [00:15:56] and.
The more [00:15:58] structured water you have in the [00:16:00] mitochondria, the easier it is for [00:16:02] that thing to spin. Mm-hmm. [00:16:04] So that's one thing that's like the ease [00:16:06] of energy production. And as we grow [00:16:08] older, it's harder for us to create energy. It's [00:16:10] like costs more energy to create
Dave: energy. Yeah. That's [00:16:12] the Krebs cycle if you guys read the books.
Amitay: [00:16:14] Okay. And the other thing is, is, and then [00:16:16] specifically let's say a, a TPAs pump. [00:16:18] But the, but the other thing is, is that [00:16:20] when we grow older, our [00:16:22] elastin. Which is a protein [00:16:24] similar to collagen, [00:16:26] has a coating, which normally has [00:16:28] it glide on top of itself and [00:16:30] other things you can think of fascia as something that [00:16:32] does that.
And as we grow older, [00:16:34] the, the coating flips as far as [00:16:36] like hydrophilic and hydrophobic and it becomes [00:16:38] sticky and red. Light therapy can [00:16:40] also, through structuring of that [00:16:42] filament can actually reverse that and [00:16:44] have it glide again. So [00:16:46] you, you gotta help it. There are [00:16:48] ingredients that can help it, but [00:16:50] but that's a really cool thing that red light therapy does [00:16:52] that is yet to be [00:16:54] explored deeply.
Dave: There are [00:16:56] studies of red light and elastin [00:16:58] formation mm-hmm. That are positive. Yeah. And what [00:17:00] you're saying is it doesn't just increase elastin, [00:17:02] it increases this glide [00:17:04] capability of it. Yeah. Because,
Amitay: because [00:17:06] one thing that red light therapy doesn't [00:17:08] do well is being, [00:17:10] is being its own stimulant. So [00:17:12] like the hormetic aspect of.
[00:17:14] Of red light isn't [00:17:16] great. And one way to [00:17:18] think about it is you really have to [00:17:20] work extremely hard to overdose on [00:17:22] red light. Mm-hmm. And [00:17:24] you don't need to work very hard to overdose [00:17:26] on as you've mentioned on [00:17:28] exercise for example, it's actually very easy to [00:17:30] overdose on exercise. That is [00:17:32] because the stimulatory aspect is quite, [00:17:34] you know, pre predominant.
[00:17:36] But what it does do, it potentiates [00:17:38] a lot of things and, and, and elast. [00:17:40] So the fibroblasts, the cells that [00:17:42] create collagen, elastin, hyaluronic acid, et [00:17:44] cetera, their, [00:17:46] they can be improved, their function can [00:17:48] be improved greatly with [00:17:50] red light. So when you [00:17:52] do other things to stimulate it, or [00:17:54] if these cells, you know, are [00:17:56] older and don't function correctly, [00:17:58] it is a great [00:18:00] therapy, a standalone therapy.
But if you [00:18:02] kind of wanna rewind time, I think [00:18:04] a lot of people expect [00:18:06] too much of red light therapy alone. So if [00:18:08] you want to kind of rewind time, [00:18:10] it should be a supportive. [00:18:12] Treatment test, some [00:18:14] stimulation that you have done[00:18:16] [00:18:18]
Dave: [00:18:20] well over training. Age your skin [00:18:22]
Amitay: a hundred percent, yes. For, [00:18:24] for two reasons. The first reason [00:18:26] is because over training just creates [00:18:28] inflammation and, [00:18:30] you know, inflammation is [00:18:32] aging what we call [00:18:34] inflammaging. Mm-hmm. But the other thing is, is [00:18:36] that every type of tissue [00:18:38] that you are damaging, or not every [00:18:40] type of tissue, but a lot of tissues that you are [00:18:42] damaging when you're training, [00:18:44] rely on collagen.[00:18:46]
So it's, I. [00:18:48] It's almost like asking me if I [00:18:50] overtrain, will my gut suffer? [00:18:52] Yes. Because gut needs collagen [00:18:54] and a lot of, uh, ultra [00:18:56] marathon athletes or just long [00:18:58] distance runners because they damage their [00:19:00] collagen in their knees, like wherever they [00:19:02] get a lot of impact. They have [00:19:04] IBS like a lot of them. It's a very [00:19:06] common thing and you can see [00:19:08] people who have done [00:19:10] extreme exercise [00:19:12] formats mm-hmm.
[00:19:14] Have really, really [00:19:16] aged the skin or their skin. Yeah. Definitely [00:19:18] is aged faster than, than it needs [00:19:20] to be.
Dave: Yeah. And some people say that's [00:19:22] from Sun, but you'll see it [00:19:24] in indoor bodybuilders and things as [00:19:26] well. Yeah. So it's not just triathletes or [00:19:28] something and it's how [00:19:30] much stress does your [00:19:32] body take to put on muscle or change VO [00:19:34] two max and then how much recovery do you get?
[00:19:36] Yeah. And the whole upgrade labs thing [00:19:38] is, let's do less but more effective training [00:19:40] and then more recovery. And I think it shows [00:19:42] in your skin
Amitay: not only that you are [00:19:44] correct. You're also, I think if we [00:19:46] really break it down, it [00:19:48] is metabolism ages [00:19:50] you in general. Mm-hmm. Just like metabolism ages [00:19:52] you the, a lot of the reason that [00:19:54] we're talking about GLP one [00:19:56] agonists right now as being some sort of [00:19:58] anti-aging, aside from [00:20:00] supporting other things.
Yes. No [00:20:02] have side effects. Yes, no, whatever. We [00:20:04] obviously are getting a lot of questions. [00:20:06] Do they? Again, like, do [00:20:08] they support skin aging? Because they, [00:20:10] they, you have like something called ozempic [00:20:12] face, which makes you lose fast fat [00:20:14] and stuff like that. But mainly the [00:20:16] reason that they're supporting healthy [00:20:18] aging is because they slow down [00:20:20] metabolism.
So when you [00:20:22] are calling on energy [00:20:24] creation in general in the body, [00:20:26] you are getting more [00:20:28] side effects. You're, you're paying for it with [00:20:30] actual aging. So if [00:20:32] you, if you, the more you train, [00:20:34] technically speaking, the faster you age. Yeah.
Dave: [00:20:36] Wow. Yeah. [00:20:38] Now, if you have proper recovery and [00:20:40] proper nutrition, your body will [00:20:42] increase the [00:20:44] antioxidants made inside your cells.
[00:20:46] Yeah. Yeah. So you can handle [00:20:48] more training. As long as everything [00:20:50] is set up right and you're sleeping and all of that, [00:20:52] can you put those [00:20:54] antioxidants directly into the skin? [00:20:56]
Amitay: You could to some [00:20:58] extent. Some of them [00:21:00] we really like for them to be [00:21:02] systemic. So, uh, I'll [00:21:04] give you an example. For example, like glutathione.[00:21:06]
Glutathione is not the [00:21:08] friendliest of molecules when you're trying to introduce it to [00:21:10] the body and you need to play tricks with it [00:21:12] and to get it into the skin, a [00:21:14] lot of the times you need to use high levels [00:21:16] of synthetic vitamin C, [00:21:18] so, mm-hmm. Vitamin C in nature [00:21:20] is, is, is a [00:21:22] complex that has a lot of minerals.
For example, [00:21:24] when we use vitamin C as a [00:21:26] shuttle vehicle, it's only the [00:21:28] outside layer of it. Mm-hmm. And that is [00:21:30] actually at very low quantities. It's already [00:21:32] pro-inflammatory. It's, I call pro aging, [00:21:34] pro uh, oxidation, [00:21:36] oxid, uh, like leads, [00:21:38] oxidation and actually causes [00:21:40] death by something called fortosis. [00:21:42] So, uh, [00:21:44] so you just punch vitamin C in the [00:21:46] face, not all vitamin C, just the [00:21:48] vi synthetic version of vitamin C.
Mm-hmm. [00:21:50] Which is ascorbic acid. Mm-hmm. [00:21:52] Uh, or ascorbic acid, which is [00:21:54] the topical version of it. [00:21:56] But using it as a shuttle vehicle [00:21:58] is kind of very dangerous. 'cause I am [00:22:00] paying for oxid oxidative [00:22:02] stress by trying to lower [00:22:04] oxidative load. So it's just like [00:22:06] one thing. But yeah, I I, if you, [00:22:08] if vitamin C was here, it would've been [00:22:10] punched in the face.
Yes, that is correct. It,
Dave: [00:22:12] it's really funny. [00:22:14] Vitamin C is important, [00:22:16] but the mega dosing [00:22:18] protocols that became really popular in [00:22:20] the nineties, there's [00:22:22] a use case if you're really sick to do [00:22:24] high dose vitamin C, but what it's [00:22:26] doing then, if you have a continuous [00:22:28] glucose moderate, it'll show that your blood sugar's like [00:22:30] 500, which is not real, but vitamin C [00:22:32] gets processed like sugar in the body above [00:22:34] what you need, which is about 250 [00:22:36] milligrams twice a day.
Mm-hmm. I don't have a [00:22:38] problem with ascorbic acid at low doses like that, [00:22:40] but if you're trying to take a [00:22:42] lot more than that, it also turns into [00:22:44] oxalate, which will age your skin [00:22:46] and age your joints, and is a fundamental [00:22:48] problem in aging that very few people are talking about. [00:22:50] Mm-hmm. Yeah. So you're [00:22:52] saying you could use a little vitamin C [00:22:54] topically, but it's just a shuttle for other [00:22:56] things?
Yes. Or would you take it orally?
Amitay: [00:22:58] So I want, I want people to take it orally. Okay. [00:23:00] Uh, they can also, you could also do [00:23:02] a lot of the, a lot of things that with [00:23:04] skincare it would be an issue. So for [00:23:06] example if I asked you to apply [00:23:08] skincare even like three times a day, I [00:23:10] think you would start to hate me.
Like, [00:23:12] you know, that's, we started the [00:23:14] conversation is like, Hey, let me [00:23:16] try and get you to do most things like [00:23:18] once a day, right? Mm-hmm. So [00:23:20]
Dave: wait, hold on. You only use Young [00:23:22] Goose once a day?
Amitay: No, I use a [00:23:24] very minimal program in the morning. Okay. [00:23:26] Just gets me out the door and [00:23:28] makes sure that the environmental stressors [00:23:30] don't age me more than I, than [00:23:32] than they would.
And in the [00:23:34] evening, that is when I cue [00:23:36] anything from repair, by the way, to my entire [00:23:38] body. Anything that I do from PEMF [00:23:40] to, uh, red light therapy to [00:23:42] skincare, if it's recovery [00:23:44] inducing, I'll do it at night as long as [00:23:46] it doesn't obviously stimulate me. So [00:23:48] in, in the morning, it's just basically, you [00:23:50] know, put on a serum [00:23:52] that has all of these active ingredients that we [00:23:54] talked about, whether it is like copper [00:23:56] peptides or serin and ad [00:23:58] precursors, et cetera.
And a [00:24:00] sunblock that we make, which [00:24:02] actually you graciously spoke about before, [00:24:04] uh, with Molly Maloof in [00:24:06] a podcast. Oh yeah. But that basically [00:24:08] protects me against the, it has ecto and [00:24:10] it has all of those things. Uh, and [00:24:12] in the evening I'll do more. But yeah, [00:24:14] that's, that's basically [00:24:16] it.
Dave: That's that's cool.
I, [00:24:18] I've just said, all right, fine. After I shave, I'm just [00:24:20] gonna smear stuff on my face. I [00:24:22] love the Young Goose products. Thank you. [00:24:24] Uh, and to be clear, that's not the only thing I put on my face. [00:24:26] Mm-hmm. I put some other stuff on too. Like I'm, I'm kind [00:24:28] of like, my God, some [00:24:30] sear a lot on, but I, I'm like, [00:24:32] I'm willing to do it.
'cause I think effect, I [00:24:34] see the difference. And then at night [00:24:36] I put
Amitay: it on again. Right. [00:24:38] I did wanna say, I just remember that you asked me [00:24:40] about, uh, doses of vitamin C. So I think it's [00:24:42] important for skincare. 'cause in skincare you will, [00:24:44] you won't. It's crazy. Like [00:24:46] I remember speaking to biohackers [00:24:48] for the first time and [00:24:50] I had to shift the way that I speak [00:24:52] from percentages [00:24:54] to.
Quantity, right? [00:24:56] Or 'cause we'll
Dave: take 50 pills if it's gonna make [00:24:58] us feel better a little. Correct.
Amitay: Right. And [00:25:00] in skincare, normally you talk about percentages. [00:25:02] So no one's gonna say, oh, I have [00:25:04] 250 megs of vitamin C in [00:25:06] my product. They're gonna say, I have, [00:25:08] you know, [00:25:10] 30% vitamin C. [00:25:12] So if we're talking about ascorbic [00:25:14] acid and not other [00:25:16] forms that are significantly better [00:25:18] for your skin, like THDA [00:25:20] or MAP, magnesium ASCO [00:25:22] phosphate it will be not [00:25:24] more than 3%.
Okay. [00:25:26] And medical grade, kind of [00:25:28] older skincare products, [00:25:30] they, they have 20 to 30. [00:25:32] This is not great. And [00:25:34] by the way, there you mentioned like mega [00:25:36] doses that was born out of like, [00:25:38] you know, anti like tumor [00:25:40] suppressant protocols, [00:25:42] which the longevity. [00:25:44] Community kind of inherited a lot of [00:25:46] those protocols.
Mm-hmm. Incorrectly, in [00:25:48] my opinion, including in a [00:25:50] eating a high oxide. By the way, that's like [00:25:52] one thing that Yeah. We inherited, [00:25:54]
Dave: there's a fat soluble form of [00:25:56] vitamin C called scorable Palmate.
Amitay: [00:25:58] Yeah.
Dave: Is that good for your skin? Or bad for your skin?
Amitay: [00:26:00] So fat-soluble vitamin C [00:26:02] are the best. If you're [00:26:04] thinking about, um, [00:26:06] first of all, they're the best and the reason [00:26:08] is is that they [00:26:10] absorb through your, your [00:26:12] fatty layer that protects your skin mm-hmm.
Part of your [00:26:14] skin barrier. Not to [00:26:16] say that water soluble vitamin [00:26:18] Cs are not good, but they do [00:26:20] mainly mitigation of like UV UV [00:26:22] damage. Okay. Why do we [00:26:24] want vitamin C to absorb more? Because it's a [00:26:26] co-factor for collagen production. So, I [00:26:28] have a friend that just had [00:26:30] surgery, like a X explan surgery. I told her, [00:26:32] Hey, really take a lot of [00:26:34] sodium, uh, uh, sodium [00:26:36] asate or calcium ate, which, [00:26:38] which are, uh, supporting [00:26:40] collagen production.
To answer your [00:26:42] question. The, this is [00:26:44] not like the best [00:26:46] form of fat soluble [00:26:48] vitamin C-T-H-D-A, uh, what [00:26:50] does that
Dave: stand for?
Amitay: THD as [00:26:52] Corbit. Tetra Adexo as corbit, [00:26:54]
Dave: okay.
Amitay: Is the best [00:26:56] version of Heyl Desal. [00:26:58] Do you take that
Dave: orally? I've never [00:27:00] seen it. No. Just topical.
Amitay: Just [00:27:02] topical. It's not great for your stomach if you took it [00:27:04] orally.
Okay. But, but [00:27:06] topical, it's actually three [00:27:08] times more powerful than ascorbic [00:27:10] acid, so we actually don't need that [00:27:12] much. And so,
Dave: so you've studied this at Young [00:27:14] Goose? Yeah. Okay. Wow. All [00:27:16] right. That is a new ingredient for me and [00:27:18] kind of know most ingredients, so that's, that's [00:27:20] super cool. THDA.
Amitay: [00:27:22] Yeah.
Dave: Okay.
Wow. All right. [00:27:24] Research.
Amitay: Funny thing is [00:27:26] we are this, uh, you know, [00:27:28] WW what we call small [00:27:30] lab, big ideas. Mm-hmm. [00:27:32] So we've, we've introduced to the market [00:27:34] things like, you know, uh, [00:27:36] I think we were the first company too. Is it Ergo [00:27:38] Thionine is another one.
Dave: Love Ergo Thionine, [00:27:40] yes. That's a potent longevity [00:27:42] molecule.
I think it's like the next glutathione. Right. So [00:27:44]
Amitay: I think we were the first ones to use it [00:27:46] topically as well. And [00:27:48] THDA when we started using it, it [00:27:50] was no one wanted to touch it [00:27:52] because they can't claim high, high, uh, [00:27:54] concentration. And that, that, [00:27:56] as you know, marketing is [00:27:58] 90% of skincare. Mm-hmm. But [00:28:00] now that, um, there is [00:28:02] a movement against ascorbic [00:28:04] acid.
Rightfully so you'll see [00:28:06] more brands using it.
Dave: [00:28:08] Okay. Very cool. So you've kind of set the [00:28:10] stage for that.
Amitay: Yeah.
Dave: Okay.
Amitay: And NAD [00:28:12] obviously we were the first ones permitting. [00:28:14] So like you, you start seeing, you know, [00:28:16] molecules that we've, we were the only ones [00:28:18] touching, becoming mainstream and it's kind of [00:28:20] cool.
Dave: Young goose is interesting [00:28:22] because, uh, we've known each other for a [00:28:24] long time and I've been tracking the [00:28:26] biohacking movement kind of since I started it. Right. [00:28:28] And we'll come [00:28:30] up with these molecules. Things will just [00:28:32] appear like sperm aine. I helped [00:28:34] the first oral sperm aine company come [00:28:36] into the US and talked about it before you could [00:28:38] buy it.
Amitay: Yeah. Uh,
Dave: in my longevity book. [00:28:40] And that is, I want it, and I at [00:28:42] least wanna take it orally. [00:28:44] What you're doing at Young Goose is saying, well, [00:28:46] most of the longevity molecules, [00:28:48] uh, that there's research on [00:28:50] internally that you can make them enter the [00:28:52] skin. Mm-hmm. And then you have a really big [00:28:54] benefit from that.
And very few companies are paying [00:28:56] attention that way. They're kind of stuck in like, let's put [00:28:58] some soybean oil in your skin or something. [00:29:00] Yeah. What does [00:29:02] using seed oils and a [00:29:04] formulation on your skin do?
Amitay: Actually? So [00:29:06] seed oils as a [00:29:08] rule can be used for good [00:29:10] in, uh, skincare. And that [00:29:12] is because, so that's, again, one of those [00:29:14] things that we have a lot of [00:29:16] leeway because it doesn't go systemically.[00:29:18]
So technically speaking, that's [00:29:20] not what, I'm not saying that that's what you should do, [00:29:22] but if you, if, if you put like a [00:29:24] rancid oil on your face, you're [00:29:26] not going to. Have the [00:29:28] same damage, [00:29:30] systemic damage that you're gonna have [00:29:32] if it were, again, like in a, in [00:29:34] a, in an oral formulation. Mm-hmm. Having [00:29:36] said that, that's not a good thing.
[00:29:38] Right. But we do need omega sixes and [00:29:40] nines. Yes, we do. For skin barrier [00:29:42] function, actually, that's a lot of what your [00:29:44] skin barrier is, even to the [00:29:46] extent that you, for example, have a vitamin [00:29:48] D. Right. In order [00:29:50] for vitamin A [00:29:52] to be managed [00:29:54] well by your skin and not have something [00:29:56] called Retin, which your skin becomes [00:29:58] red, flaky, irritated, et cetera, [00:30:00] you kind of need omega nines.
[00:30:02] So seed oils in [00:30:04] general. Can be [00:30:06] used responsibly [00:30:08] with ingredients that make [00:30:10] sure that they spoil the least amount as [00:30:12] possible. And also, by the way, [00:30:14] formulate not like 700 [00:30:16] years in advance because most products [00:30:18] you buy off, you know, the [00:30:20] Sephora Shelf, the proverbial [00:30:22] Sephora shelf are 18 months [00:30:24] old.
Dave: Mm. So they've had a chance to break [00:30:26] down.
Amitay: Yes. So [00:30:28] just think of that. You want companies that [00:30:30] formulate about three months in advance, let's [00:30:32] say. Uh, and then it could be [00:30:34] positive. The negative [00:30:36] aspects is if they're rancid, [00:30:38] statistically, you could have some acidity there, but if [00:30:40] they're rancid, they're going to render [00:30:42] your skin barrier permeable more.
[00:30:44] Permeable. What? You know, Kiran [00:30:46] Krishna and I, uh mm-hmm. [00:30:48] Call. The leaky skin [00:30:50] factor, which is different than [00:30:52] leaky gut, but yeah,
Dave: leaky skin's a big [00:30:54] deal. Yeah. Um, years ago I had a Stanford [00:30:56] researcher who wrote a book called The End of Food [00:30:58] Allergies. Mm-hmm. And her point was, [00:31:00] a lot of our allergic triggers are from [00:31:02] leaky skin barrier.
Yeah. And [00:31:04] using a good quality skincare [00:31:06] seals the barrier, right?
Amitay: Yes. [00:31:08] By the way, sperming, one of the best [00:31:10] benefits of benefits of sperming in the skin. It's actually [00:31:12] for skin barrier because it's [00:31:14] not only a longevity molecules for you, it's also for [00:31:16] your microorganisms that are [00:31:18] important. But having said that, [00:31:20] when we think of skin, uh, leaky [00:31:22] skin, we really want to think of leakage of [00:31:24] information.
So part of what I said about like, [00:31:26] the senescent burden in your [00:31:28] skin and how it hijacks [00:31:30] the skin, brain access, [00:31:32] that's technically, you could also think of it as leaky [00:31:34] skin, right? Because it leaks [00:31:36] con like [00:31:38] pro aging information. [00:31:40] To your body. [00:31:42] So another thing would be [00:31:44] any ingredient that [00:31:46] cannot be cleared well by the skin.
So [00:31:48] resveratrol is actually a [00:31:50] great polyphenol for the skin, but if it's not [00:31:52] fermented it, your skin [00:31:54] cannot break it down, doesn't have the enzyme to break it down. [00:31:56] Mm-hmm. And it becomes, again, [00:31:58] pro aging. It actually stresses your [00:32:00] skin, stresses your body in return. [00:32:02] So again, it's it's [00:32:04] leakage of, of [00:32:06] stressors rather than the actual [00:32:08] molecules.
And that, that applies also [00:32:10] by the way to allergic reactions.
Dave: [00:32:12] So, interesting.
Amitay: Yeah. [00:32:14] Okay. What about saturated fat [00:32:16] in the skin? [00:32:18] So, so saturated fat [00:32:20] is great. Great in the [00:32:22] skin, spoilage is still an [00:32:24] issue. So you see, um, [00:32:26] yes. Since there are a lot [00:32:28] of companies using, uh, beef [00:32:30] talo mm-hmm. In their formulation, [00:32:32] um.
It [00:32:34] a little bit bothers me to [00:32:36] speak negatively about that because we [00:32:38] were a small company once and I would [00:32:40] never want anyone to speak badly about [00:32:42] myself. But here's like, [00:32:44] uh, something that people should know, [00:32:46] such like, um, beef Tallow [00:32:48] has a shelf life of about six [00:32:50] months. Yep. That is if you kept it in a [00:32:52] cool place and didn't touch [00:32:54] it with your dirty fingers every day.
[00:32:56] So if you did that, obviously that's not the [00:32:58] case. So [00:33:00] there is an issue of spoilage there, [00:33:02] especially if we're doing something that's called clean [00:33:04] washing, which is like the Clean [00:33:06] skincare. Um, uh. [00:33:08] Field likes to tout [00:33:10] What? They do not have it, it is like [00:33:12] greenwashing. Exactly. Like, oh, it's gluten free. Like [00:33:14] Yeah.
It's still
Dave: not good for you.
Amitay: By the way, I [00:33:16] remember, uh, the first time we were in [00:33:18] Equinox, so now we're kind of rolling out in [00:33:20] Equinox. I remember the first time they had us, like in a booth, they [00:33:22] wanted to test us out. Mm-hmm. And they tested [00:33:24] us out. And another skincare brand. [00:33:26] And the entire thing that the other [00:33:28] skincare brand could say is that they're vegan.[00:33:30]
Oh, it's good 'cause it's vegan. It's [00:33:32] vegan. It's vegan. It's vegan, it's vegan. And the [00:33:34] funny thing was, is like, that's where I [00:33:36] invented the idea of clean washing. Yeah. Because [00:33:38] you, you are, you know, you [00:33:40] race to the bottom. Everyone else can say the [00:33:42] same thing. You are just [00:33:44] eliminating the conversation around what, [00:33:46] what is beneficial.
Mm-hmm. Or [00:33:48] fearmongering, et cetera. So [00:33:50] because of that, [00:33:52] uh, silo, because of that [00:33:54] eco chamber within the clean [00:33:56] skincare field, I. You're [00:33:58] not getting people who are incentivized to keep [00:34:00] things stable. [00:34:02] And what happens when you have that is you have [00:34:04] high spoilage, you have a lot of like, [00:34:06] mold in skincare products.
Mm-hmm. A lot by the [00:34:08] way. Um, [00:34:10] so saturated fats are great [00:34:12] within the confines of [00:34:14] good [00:34:16] truthful formulation.
Dave: Thanks for [00:34:18] saying that. Yeah. I think there's value [00:34:20] for saturated fat. MCT [00:34:22] oil is a saturated fat, you can put that on your skin. [00:34:24] Steric acid is good for your skin. Right. We,
Amitay: we [00:34:26] use CT in every [00:34:28] product we make, I think.
Dave: Cool. Yeah. [00:34:30] And, um, it, it's [00:34:32] very true. I have [00:34:34] made my own talo. Right. [00:34:36] And putting just straight talo in your skin's a little [00:34:38] bit shiny.
Amitay: Mm-hmm.
Dave: Right. So a lot of [00:34:40] companies will blend it with water.
Amitay: [00:34:42] Mm-hmm.
Dave: Right. You can emulsify it that way. Mm-hmm. [00:34:44] And then, like I said, there's gonna be a S spillage [00:34:46] issue.
'cause anytime there's water in an ingredient, [00:34:48] you can have molded things. So then you put in [00:34:50] things that are going to stop it from a [00:34:52] spoiling, but they have to also not ruin the [00:34:54] bacteria on the skin. So I think that [00:34:56] there's a role for talo in skincare, but what you're [00:34:58] saying is be cautious, has be well [00:35:00] formulated with a lot of science and probably not single [00:35:02] ingredient.
Amitay: Right. Exactly. And by the [00:35:04] way, MCT, I'm telling you, from [00:35:06] playing with Talo for the [00:35:08] last two years for sure, [00:35:10] maybe more. It doesn't behave [00:35:12] as well as MCT, like M MCTs a [00:35:14] significantly better molecule to deal with.
Dave: I'm [00:35:16] kind of a fan of MCT, maybe turned into a [00:35:18] billion dollar industry category. I Exactly. [00:35:20] And, uh, it does work very [00:35:22] well topically.
Mm-hmm. There are people in the [00:35:24] longevity space who are gonna carry an [00:35:26] umbrella and say, I could never be in the sun. Or, [00:35:28] you know, sun is bad for your skin. [00:35:30] What's your take on that?
Amitay: I think [00:35:32] it's nuanced. First of all, they're wrong. [00:35:34] Okay. Let's just start with that. Okay. They are [00:35:36] incorrect. What? They're [00:35:38] incor and they're, they're, you [00:35:40] know, what I love about biohacking?
I mean, you have a [00:35:42] great line around biohacking, which [00:35:44] is like, you know, altering the environment [00:35:46] around you, within you in order to affect your bio [00:35:48] biology. That's, I mean, that's [00:35:50] how, you know, if my uncle [00:35:52] asked me, what is biohacking? I'll, I'll tell him [00:35:54] that. But I think [00:35:56] another thing to say about biohacking is [00:35:58] extracting good [00:36:00] responses.
To bad [00:36:02] environmental cues, so mm-hmm. You know, [00:36:04] talking, like, talking about red light therapy, [00:36:06] 'cause we have a, we have [00:36:08] talked about it, the sun as a [00:36:10] whole can damage you. [00:36:12] So your body has, Eve has [00:36:14] kind of evolved to respond to that with, [00:36:16] with some [00:36:18] regenerative processes. So we're kinda [00:36:20] harvesting that and providing it separately [00:36:22] and kind of tricking the body.
Right. [00:36:24] So that is, that is to say the [00:36:26] sun has [00:36:28] benefits that we should [00:36:30] use, that we should interact with, [00:36:32] but we can do it in a more [00:36:34] biohacking way. So [00:36:36] I'll give you one statistic. [00:36:38] Blue light is as bad for your [00:36:40] mitochondria. Is red and near [00:36:42] infrared light are good for your mitochondria? Mm-hmm. [00:36:44] So if you're in an office or in front of your [00:36:46] phone or computer for eight hours and [00:36:48] then you do your 10 minutes red light therapy, [00:36:50] you're not doing much.
And if you [00:36:52] are exposed to pollution, heavy metals, [00:36:54] EMFs and blue light. [00:36:56] And then go out to the sun. [00:36:58] The areas that were exposed [00:37:00] are really bad at dealing with sun damage. [00:37:02] Mm-hmm. And there is research out of the [00:37:04] UN Uni University that's in, uh, [00:37:06] Seoul, Korea, showing that [00:37:08] exposure to red light therapy, which is obviously [00:37:10] improving mitochondrial function, can [00:37:12] help you deal, deal with the [00:37:14] damage of the sun.
What I wanna say by [00:37:16] that is if you're going outside, so you've, you've [00:37:18] had, uh, you've taken some flack for [00:37:20] like, uh, a butt tanning, [00:37:22] what's, what's it called? Butthole, tan butthole. [00:37:24] Tanning or sunning? Butthole. Sunning. [00:37:26] Yeah. But butthole. Sunning. Why is [00:37:28] that? You know, if you don't burn your [00:37:30] butthole, why is that good?
It's because [00:37:32] this has not been exposed to a lot of [00:37:34] bad mm-hmm. Things [00:37:36] and it's very kind of, uh, [00:37:38] reactive. 'cause it's white. Right. [00:37:40] And that's going to. [00:37:42] Synthesize way more vitamin D than [00:37:44] your arms, for example, in a [00:37:46] t-shirt being exposed to artificial [00:37:48] life for like eight hours. [00:37:50] Meaning if you want to harvest the [00:37:52] good effects of direct sunlight [00:37:54] exposure, do it in areas that [00:37:56] are not being bombarded [00:37:58] with with bad, [00:38:00] bad cues all day.
Mm-hmm. [00:38:02] Mainly your solar [00:38:04] panel of your, your, your [00:38:06] torso and [00:38:08] thighs. Mm-hmm. Most skin [00:38:10] there anyway. Right. Exactly. And it's [00:38:12] also, uh, there is some evidence that you know, [00:38:14] fat, which that's where you kind of carry more [00:38:16] fat, has some con [00:38:18] contributing factors as far as like dealing with [00:38:20] damage. It actually contributes stem cells [00:38:22] to your skin.
Uh, you have [00:38:24] more blood circulation there. [00:38:26] Uh, your, your, your muscles there are bigger. [00:38:28] They, they, they pump more [00:38:30] blood there. So all of those things [00:38:32] are actually really good at [00:38:34] synthesizing vitamin D. But in general, [00:38:36] dealing with that sun onslaught of [00:38:38] UV radiation, your [00:38:40] face and your your [00:38:42] arms or your feet are actually [00:38:44] not really good at it.
So [00:38:46] that's just be more of a [00:38:48] biohacker around it. Like just do [00:38:50] a more thoughtful [00:38:52] job as far as like getting the good without the [00:38:54] negative and yeah, protect your face. [00:38:56]
Dave: I've noticed that if [00:38:58] I, well, if, if I go [00:39:00] to the trouble of minimizing [00:39:02] omega six fat in my diet, which [00:39:04] I've done for the last 15 [00:39:06] years, very reliably, I [00:39:08] don't get sunburned.
It takes a [00:39:10] lot for me to get sunburned. I [00:39:12] also minimize my exposure to [00:39:14] LED lighting and blue lighting. Sorry for the [00:39:16] studio lights. It's the only time they're on in here. [00:39:18] And. We [00:39:20] know that melanoma, [00:39:22] which is supposed to be caused by the sun, [00:39:24] is way more highly correlated [00:39:26] with fluorescent lights and LED lights.
So [00:39:28] it's your office lighting that causes melanoma, [00:39:30] not sunshine, but [00:39:32] sunburns are correlated with it. [00:39:34] Mm-hmm. So, [00:39:36] huh, well
Amitay: then what about wrinkles?
Dave: [00:39:38] What do you know about UV light and wrinkles?
Amitay: Okay, [00:39:40] so first of all, you know the [00:39:42] first aspect of it's just like [00:39:44] oxidative stress. So [00:39:46] obviously if you have omega six, you have higher [00:39:48] oxidative load.
And [00:39:50] what really happens in with the sun is [00:39:52] that it increases oxidative stress. Mm-hmm. [00:39:54] We, we don't have like UV [00:39:56] particles or photons are not [00:39:58] traveling around our skin just destroying it. [00:40:00] They kind of do that a little bit, which is the [00:40:02] second part of what I'm gonna say. But in general, it [00:40:04] all gets translated to [00:40:06] oxidative stress.
So if you [00:40:08] minimize oxidative stress in your [00:40:10] skin, you're gonna get better responses as far [00:40:12] as like UV radiation. And [00:40:14] you can by what you eat, [00:40:16] modulate your [00:40:18] natural SPF. Mm-hmm. In air [00:40:20] quotes by about a factor of like seven. [00:40:22] [00:40:24] Plus and minus, by the way. Mm-hmm. [00:40:26] But as far as wrinkles, one of [00:40:28] the things that UV does directly [00:40:30] is damage your DNA and [00:40:32] fuse parts.
It's called prim in [00:40:34] dimers. It fuses parts of your DNA [00:40:36] together. And that is not, [00:40:38] that has been considered [00:40:40] impossible to repair. [00:40:42] And that leads to [00:40:44] malfunction, malfunctioning, [00:40:46] epigenetic expression, [00:40:48] especially around collagen genes, [00:40:50] elastin genes genes that are [00:40:52] responsible, something called PARPs, which are [00:40:54] enzymes that are responsible for repair of that [00:40:56] damage.
They're, they're really, [00:40:58] really getting damaged there, [00:41:00] but also. That depletes a [00:41:02] lot of NAD. So you have like this [00:41:04] monster of da [00:41:06] damage the DNA that can't do things [00:41:08] correctly. You have these damaged [00:41:10] enzymes that can't do things [00:41:12] correctly and you, the molecule [00:41:14] that's responsible for fueling all of [00:41:16] that, uh, goodness is [00:41:18] also being depleted.
So it's a three-headed [00:41:20] monster right [00:41:22] now. I believe we are the only ones at the [00:41:24] moment that have succeeded in rever [00:41:26] or creating a topical product that you [00:41:28] can use right now. 'cause there's a lot of [00:41:30] study around it that can [00:41:32] reverse the UV induced [00:41:34] DNA damage. This is the, [00:41:36] the Young Goose part. Which product is that?
It's called [00:41:38] Ladder, which is a, a, [00:41:40] you know, it's a joke on the ladder of your [00:41:42] DNA, but it means light activated DNA [00:41:44] repair. Wow. Yes.
Dave: [00:41:46] Do you have to
Amitay: use
Dave: red light with it?
Amitay: [00:41:48] Technically speaking, you need a [00:41:50] light rich environment. Okay. [00:41:52] So I. You need at [00:41:54] least, so you need red light or [00:41:56] Amber? Amber is, is is [00:41:58] 5 5 [00:42:00] 35, which is I know, I [00:42:02] know.
5 35 to about [00:42:04] 900. Mm-hmm. Which is like amber [00:42:06] red, near infrared. And a lot of the [00:42:08] reasons that Amber is good [00:42:10] for your skin is because it activates [00:42:12] those enzymes independently [00:42:14] of any product. Do you know why I laughed? [00:42:16] Yes. Because you were the first ones to say that Amber, [00:42:18] for your skin
Dave: and Well, I think we're still the [00:42:20] only light therapy.
This is true light. Uh, [00:42:22] a company, my friend Alan's running it now, I'm [00:42:24] still a shareholder. We're the [00:42:26] only light panel out there. It's still at the [00:42:28] lower end of the price curve and it's got [00:42:30] both reds, infrared and amber. 'cause the [00:42:32] studies on Amber have been out for 10 plus years. And you're the [00:42:34] only person who's talked about that.
Amitay: Yeah, I love it. Yeah. [00:42:36] And actually to your if [00:42:38] you, so if one wanted [00:42:40] a crazy, strong red light [00:42:42] therapy device, they could definitely [00:42:44] find more expensive devices than, than [00:42:46] what you are you are offering. But the [00:42:48] good news are, as far as like Amber Light. [00:42:50] There is no one [00:42:52] single [00:42:54] note lit in the [00:42:56] literature that shows that you actually need a lot, you [00:42:58] need very little because you're only going [00:43:00] to interact with the skin.
[00:43:02] That, that wavelength is not really great at [00:43:04] kind of penetrating past the skin.
Dave: It it's [00:43:06] just for the skin and the micro capillaries in [00:43:08] the studies. Correct, yes. [00:43:10] I've also seen studies of [00:43:12] UVA and UVB showing [00:43:14] actually really strong effects, [00:43:16] moderate to low doses, [00:43:18] reduce wrinkles. Yeah. And they [00:43:20] reduce nearsightedness and they seem to be [00:43:22] necessary.
So it kind of drives me nuts when people are [00:43:24] like, well, UUV light is bad, therefore I'll [00:43:26] have none. It's sort of like saying, well, I could [00:43:28] drown in water, therefore I'll stop drinking it. [00:43:30] Mm-hmm. So I'm a huge fan of that. 20 [00:43:32] minutes at the beginning of the day [00:43:34] into the day outdoors. And [00:43:36] I also recommend that people [00:43:38] don't wear sunglasses [00:43:40] because the eyes are seeing what [00:43:42] color it is.
And they're probably working via the [00:43:44] central timing clock to [00:43:46] tell the body what compounds to make in [00:43:48] response to the sunlight.
Amitay: Yeah.
Dave: Most of the [00:43:50] studies showing UVA and UVB [00:43:52] harm to cells are done in [00:43:54] cells that don't have red and [00:43:56] infrared all the stuff. So sunlight has [00:43:58] a different effect. What is the [00:44:00] minimum effective dose of [00:44:02] sunlight that might be good for your skin?
And what is [00:44:04] the point at which it definitely becomes [00:44:06] bad?
Amitay: This is a very nuanced answer, [00:44:08] because the darker you are, yeah, the [00:44:10] more sun you need. But also the higher [00:44:12] the UV end index, the less you need. [00:44:14] Mm-hmm. So, uh, if I [00:44:16] can find it, I'll send it to you. I actually have an [00:44:18] algorithm that you crunch in your, what is it?
[00:44:20] What's called a Fitzpatrick skin [00:44:22] type. It's like how dark are you? How dark you [00:44:24] are. And um, there is a [00:44:26] funny way to find out nuances to [00:44:28] that, uh, which is looking at your [00:44:30] areola. Okay. [00:44:32] Because it means like [00:44:34] how your, what is kind of your other [00:44:36] limit? 'Cause you're, if your areola is [00:44:38] very dark, it means that you're, you can produce a [00:44:40] lot of pigment, basically.
Okay. And the [00:44:42] other thing is UV index where you are in [00:44:44] the world and UV index. [00:44:46] And you get some kind of a [00:44:48] blurb of, of how much sun you [00:44:50] should get. But it, you know, funny enough, [00:44:52] it's like seven to 12 minutes, that's, [00:44:54] that's the range that people are gonna [00:44:56] get.
Dave: Okay. Seven to 12 minutes. Mm-hmm.
[00:44:58] Depending on the intensity of the sun. Mm-hmm. So if it's [00:45:00] morning or evening, it's probably longer.
Amitay: [00:45:02] Correct. So that, that's in, that's in, that's, [00:45:04] uh, that's in either 10 or [00:45:06] four. Okay. That's the, uh, that's the Oh, [00:45:08] and what time? Of day it is. So [00:45:10] 10 and four are the [00:45:12] times that I think you should aim at
Dave: or [00:45:14] maybe a little bit before depending on what sunrise is, [00:45:16] is correct, yes.
Got [00:45:18] it. This is like really detailed [00:45:20] information, but if you're a biohacker, you want to know [00:45:22] like what's the best thing to do. And maybe you go [00:45:24] out at 11 and you just get a bit less, [00:45:26] like it doesn't have to be perfect, it just wants to be [00:45:28] in that.
Amitay: Correct. And because there [00:45:30] are, so why [00:45:32] did we even evolve to react [00:45:34] to red and near infrared?
Mm-hmm. [00:45:36] And that is because these [00:45:38] wavelengths don't get [00:45:40] absorbed in water very well. [00:45:42] So when you're, I mean anyone who looked at [00:45:44] sunrises and sunsets, they know that they're more [00:45:46] prominent, predominant there and less [00:45:48] blue light is less. Right? Right. [00:45:50] So your [00:45:52] body absorbs a [00:45:54] lot of red and near infrared if you [00:45:56] are exposing it early enough [00:45:58] in the day to that light, [00:46:00] and as we, as I quoted the, the [00:46:02] study before, it can then [00:46:04] deal with more sun.
Kind of, if you [00:46:06] are getting exposed to that, you [00:46:08] know, 11 or even 12. Mm-hmm. [00:46:10] But if you are working on, on [00:46:12] your computer and then you're like, oh [00:46:14] yeah, I remember I need to get, you know, sun [00:46:16] some sunlight, and you're getting out there at [00:46:18] 12, your body is [00:46:20] completely shocked. And by the way, you mentioned the eyes.
So [00:46:22] every part of your body did not prepare for [00:46:24] this. Today.[00:46:26] [00:46:28]
Dave: You might notice [00:46:30] in the studio there's red and [00:46:32] amber lighting around because we're also [00:46:34] exposed to the studio lights. [00:46:36] That's not by accident. Those are actually [00:46:38] true light products as well. And I, 'cause we're not trying [00:46:40] to get you to buy true light stuff. I'm just saying [00:46:42] there's a reason that things look the way [00:46:44] they're in my environment.
'cause I believe in setting it up. [00:46:46] Is that enough to counteract [00:46:48] these really bright studio lights? Probably [00:46:50] not. But it's enough to at least help. [00:46:52] I think it's,
Amitay: yeah, a hundred percent. Then I [00:46:54] think you, you know, uh, I'm sure [00:46:56] you're. You are [00:46:58] offsetting it as much as possible [00:47:00] by being outside, by waking up early [00:47:02] enough, you know, exposing your eyes first [00:47:04] thing in the morning to sun.
So there is a, it's not [00:47:06] like think, uh, the [00:47:08] other side of what we're running the risk of is [00:47:10] kind of over analyzing and like mm-hmm. [00:47:12] Over obsessing about things. [00:47:14] So you're, we're gonna be here for an hour or two, [00:47:16] then you go outside and, and you, you get some [00:47:18] sunlight.
Dave: Okay. I've heard you say [00:47:20] that you can double red light therapy [00:47:22] results.
How do you do it?
Amitay: So, one thing, [00:47:24] so then we can ask [00:47:26] ourselves why are the results [00:47:28] there or what's stopping [00:47:30] us from just getting results [00:47:32] by, by being in front of a panel [00:47:34] for like, the whole day. Right? [00:47:36] So two things. So what red light does [00:47:38] it, it, it, it basically increases [00:47:40] the amount of oxygen your mitochondria [00:47:42] can use and it spits out nitric [00:47:44] oxide.
So maybe I should [00:47:46] start by saying. When you [00:47:48] create energy in your mit, you have [00:47:50] some mitochondrial dysfunction. [00:47:52] You are creating nitric [00:47:54] oxide in the mitochondria. [00:47:56] Nitric oxide in the mitochondria [00:47:58] is a negative, and that is [00:48:00] because it kind [00:48:02] of, the oxygen molecule [00:48:04] there docks on where [00:48:06] oxygen would've [00:48:08] been u utilized called CCO [00:48:10] cytochrome C oxidase.
What red [00:48:12] light does predominantly, obviously we talked [00:48:14] about other things, but predominantly it breaks the [00:48:16] bond between nitric oxide and CCO [00:48:18] and spits out the, the nitric [00:48:20] oxide, which then you get the benefits of nitric
Dave: ide. So then you get [00:48:22] blood flow, you get circulation in the [00:48:24] cell. Yeah.
Amitay: Yeah.
Dave: And too much [00:48:26] nitric oxide makes perine nitrite, which is the [00:48:28] worst free radical from metabolism.
[00:48:30] Yeah. Can we stop that?
Amitay: [00:48:32] Yes. So, so, so [00:48:34] we can, we can mitigate some of that then by, by the [00:48:36] way, your body does it. [00:48:38] With SOD, uh, which is, its kind [00:48:40] of own, we, we talk about [00:48:42] glutathione, aol, but sods as [00:48:44] far as the skin is concerned, they're much bigger player [00:48:46] in, in antioxidant [00:48:48] responses. Another thing that happens [00:48:50] is relating to oxidative [00:48:52] stress is you're releasing [00:48:54] reactive oxygen species of, or [00:48:56] ROS from the mitochondria [00:48:58] outwards.
These are your two [00:49:00] cues for your body to say, Hey, I'm [00:49:02] creating a lot of energy. It doesn't know you've provided [00:49:04] red light. Right? I'm creating a lot of [00:49:06] energy. And here are the waste [00:49:08] materials that you could gauge the amount of energy [00:49:10] like US guy gauging [00:49:12] the amount of people in a party by clicking the [00:49:14] clicker thingy.
Okay? I always ask them, [00:49:16] by the way, what's the, uh, um, [00:49:18] so your body [00:49:20] has safe kind of stop [00:49:22] gaps to stop [00:49:24] reaction to red light because of that. [00:49:26] Okay? What we [00:49:28] can do is, first of all, I. [00:49:30] Kind of stop the [00:49:32] reactive oxygen, eliminate the rea, [00:49:34] the reactive oxygen species. And you [00:49:36] mentioned some of them, but we have like a few [00:49:38] categories.
Mm-hmm. By using very [00:49:40] specific antioxidants. One of them is [00:49:42] ergot thine, which is a specific mitochondrial [00:49:44] antioxidant. EGCG [00:49:46] is another one that people could do at home. They can [00:49:48] literally brew green tea and spray it on their [00:49:50] face after it's cooled down, by the way. But [00:49:52] yeah. Um, that's another thing [00:49:54] you could do.
You could just drink a lot of green tea. [00:49:56] Um, but you put EGCG in your stuff, right? [00:49:58] Yeah. But when, now, now we're using more [00:50:00] advanced ones. Okay. Uh, EGCG [00:50:02] limits you a lot in what you can put with [00:50:04] it 'cause it's so reactive.
Dave: Okay. Got
Amitay: it. [00:50:06] Um. And we're even working on putting [00:50:08] SOD in, in products.
Dave: [00:50:10] I I love SOD [00:50:12] as a, as a compound on the skin.
[00:50:14] Yeah. SOD is so [00:50:16] potent at, at scavenging free [00:50:18] radicals that I've taken it orally and it [00:50:20] just racks me for days. Because [00:50:22] you need enough free radicals for [00:50:24] mitochondria to function. Yeah. Because if you fully [00:50:26] suppress oxidation, the ox [00:50:28] redox reaction that makes life happen mm-hmm. [00:50:30] Will be suppressed.
Amitay: Yes. You also [00:50:32] need it.
So the, so a [00:50:34] lot of ti times, uh, we [00:50:36] say the reactive oxygen [00:50:38] species are bad, their [00:50:40] movement is good. So the [00:50:42] movement of from mitochondria [00:50:44] out outwards and different tissues in the [00:50:46] body is actually a trigger to [00:50:48] things like, uh, NF kappa [00:50:50] Beta, which is kind the, the, the master switch of [00:50:52] inflammation or, um, some [00:50:54] other factors like enzymes that repair DNA.
[00:50:56] We actually want them to move [00:50:58] around. And that is one of the hidden benefits [00:51:00] of, uh, of, uh, the keto diet, [00:51:02] by the way, is what? Yeah. The, the [00:51:04] movement of, uh, reactive oxygen species. Mm. [00:51:06] Okay. But, so that's one [00:51:08] aspect of how we can improve red light therapy [00:51:10] because we stop the cue [00:51:12] to stop reacting [00:51:14] to red light therapy.
The other thing [00:51:16] is we use a [00:51:18] principle that allows more [00:51:20] photons to be created. So we use a [00:51:22] derivative of an algae that's [00:51:24] photoluminescent that can create [00:51:26] photons that creates amber [00:51:28] light photons. By the way, 5 35. [00:51:30]
Dave: What do you have to do to make it create the [00:51:32] amber? Do you have to give light?
Amitay: You have to expose, you have to kind of [00:51:34] give it a photon and then it creates it, it [00:51:36] allows the photons to continue and creates another [00:51:38] one.
Dave: So you have a [00:51:40] compound in young Goose that when you're exposed to [00:51:42] light, it makes amber light directly on the [00:51:44] skin. Yeah,
Amitay: it's called spirulina ap, and it's from [00:51:46] spirulina, but it's called spirulina ap. It's [00:51:48] cool. Yeah, you can't [00:51:50] just have spirulina applied on the face. It, by the way, makes [00:51:52] your face sense.
You're sensitive. We [00:51:54] need to like take this specific. [00:51:56] Compound and, you know, purified. Put it [00:51:58] Yeah. Purified and, and and have it in [00:52:00] enough dosage like many other [00:52:02] things in order for it to be effective. [00:52:04] Wow. And the third thing [00:52:06] are those, uh, [00:52:08] lysosomes or DNA repair enzymes that [00:52:10] are photo activated. So these three [00:52:12] things together do [00:52:14] more than double the effects of red light therapy, [00:52:16] but we say double in order not [00:52:18] to, in order to have like a, a, [00:52:20] a con something that people [00:52:22] can understand
Dave: and it's conservative.
Okay. Yeah. [00:52:24] So to do that, you put this [00:52:26] combination? Yeah. It's the latter product. You put [00:52:28] that on your face and then you do red light [00:52:30] therapy
Amitay: and then you do red light therapy. [00:52:32] And one of the cool things that it does [00:52:34] is that it also helps [00:52:36] you create more NAD. Mm-hmm. [00:52:38] Most of the discussion around [00:52:40] NADI know you like Quaia for example.
[00:52:42] Sure. So Quaia [00:52:44] do does something really cool with their [00:52:46] NAD supplements where we're saying [00:52:48] we're not gonna only give you NAD [00:52:50] precursors, we're gonna help them [00:52:52] kind of move along.
Dave: Yeah.
Amitay: [00:52:54] Another thing you can do and topically it's a little [00:52:56] bit, you need to make sure that you're using [00:52:58] ingredients that have really high [00:53:00] impact.
At low [00:53:02] percentages. At low concentrations. [00:53:04] One thing you can do is use [00:53:06] herbal extracts that stimulate [00:53:08] N-A-M-P-T, which is the YES [00:53:10] recycling pathway. The salvage pathway of an ad. [00:53:12] That's another way [00:53:14] to, to increase NAD in the body. So we [00:53:16] give NAD precursors, but we also [00:53:18] help the body make more [00:53:20] NAD, which is very important, [00:53:22] especially when you use red light therapy.
'cause you [00:53:24] want the body to [00:53:26] respond to it
Dave: better. So it's [00:53:28] interesting quality. Just published studies [00:53:30] showing that the combination of stuff they're doing [00:53:32] increases NAD levels [00:53:34] by 67% in your cells. Mm-hmm. Which is way [00:53:36] more than normal precursors do. [00:53:38] But if you wanna get it in your skin, you go from the [00:53:40] outside in.
And that's the Y [00:53:42] Goose approach. So that, that's pretty elegant.
Amitay: [00:53:44] Yeah. And we work. Okay. I mean, we [00:53:46] ev if you ask people who work for [00:53:48] Quaia, they use Yang Goose, [00:53:50] we use Quaia. Uh, they [00:53:52] recommend us a lot. We recommend them. Okay. I would [00:53:54] also say that what Qualia does that it's interesting [00:53:56] and it's, uh, not, I mean, [00:53:58] shouting out my personal friends, [00:54:00] what they're doing is interesting because a lot of the [00:54:02] times when you just, uh, look at [00:54:04] tests like, uh, over the counter [00:54:06] NAD tests mm-hmm.
They [00:54:08] test NAD [00:54:10] circulating in your body, which doesn't mean it got into
Dave: [00:54:12] cells,
Amitay: actually. One [00:54:14] could argue that an [00:54:16] ineffective NAD supplement [00:54:18] would do a better job with that [00:54:20] test because it Oh, it [00:54:22] doesn't, you, you're, you're not getting it [00:54:24] into your cell. Uh, that's one of the [00:54:26] knocks on a lot of the. [00:54:28] Sperm Aine naysayers [00:54:30] where they're saying, Hey, we don't see a lot of, [00:54:32] or by the way, N-A-D-I-V.
Mm-hmm. [00:54:34] Naysayers where they're saying, [00:54:36] Hey, we can see a lot of it in [00:54:38] the blood. That's, [00:54:40] you're not saying anything there, by the way. [00:54:42]
Dave: It's kind of funny. [00:54:44] In the early days of the keto [00:54:46] movement, I notice [00:54:48] once I'm used to it, my [00:54:50] ketone levels are gonna be around one, maybe [00:54:52] 1.5, but not [00:54:54] higher. And you get these new people go, I got my [00:54:56] ketone levels up to four.
I'm like, [00:54:58] congratulations, you haven't learned how to metabolize [00:55:00] ketones because people who have flexible [00:55:02] metabolisms ketones will be sucked outta your blood in [00:55:04] your mitochondria. Yeah. And it's the same with blood [00:55:06] sugar. Oh. Like my blood sugar levels are 300. [00:55:08] Okay. You have diabetes, it means that you're not doing a [00:55:10] good job energetically.
Yes, exactly. [00:55:12] So the idea that if you put it in the body [00:55:14] and it doesn't end up in the blood, [00:55:16] well either went into your cells or you pooped it [00:55:18] out.
Amitay: Yes.
Dave: Okay.
Amitay: Yeah. [00:55:20]
Dave: Got it. It's so [00:55:22] fascinating. What is the single most [00:55:24] powerful skincare ingredient that no one's talking [00:55:26] about yet?
Amitay: Sperming definitely is [00:55:28] the, okay, cool.
[00:55:30] Unfortunately, we've built a [00:55:32] company around [00:55:34] NAD and it took us, [00:55:36] I mean, I talked with you [00:55:38] first about having [00:55:40] sperming in our skincare products [00:55:42] in [00:55:44] Orlando 2021. [00:55:46] Yeah, right. So, [00:55:48] but we started research [00:55:50] 2014, so it took us seven [00:55:52] years to realize that there is a stronger [00:55:54] compound [00:55:56] that would promote, you know, [00:55:58] youthful function in the skin.
[00:56:00] The reason is, is because what we want to [00:56:02] do in the end of the day, and, and we talked about [00:56:04] mitochondrial function, for example, that is one [00:56:06] out of 12 hallmarks of aging, [00:56:08] or, you know, if you ask, really ask me, [00:56:10] I, I claim that there are about 24, but let's say [00:56:12] 12. Okay. The [00:56:14] better you or the more [00:56:16] profoundly in, in.
Better. You [00:56:18] cover more of those hallmarks of [00:56:20] aging, the better the compound, [00:56:22] especially in skincare, [00:56:24] because at the end of the day, you are limited to [00:56:26] how much things you can [00:56:28] put in a product. So [00:56:30] if I've only eliminated senescence, [00:56:32] so we have a product called ProCare, [00:56:34] all it does is eliminate senescent cells.[00:56:36]
Most of the time, if you ask me [00:56:38] what product I should use, that's not gonna be the [00:56:40] first product I recommend, or even I don't recommend [00:56:42] it to, to use it all the time. Because you [00:56:44] are focused on [00:56:46] one factor [00:56:48] that is a, you're, you're, [00:56:50] you're, you are trying to you know, [00:56:52] treat a fire [00:56:54] that is one of many [00:56:56] fires and you, you're [00:56:58] not even catching the person who started it.[00:57:00]
Got it. So [00:57:02] climbing more upstream, [00:57:04] trying to deal with things that are [00:57:06] more effective in [00:57:08] many levels of skin. [00:57:10] Issues is where you [00:57:12] wanna go. Then if you wanna look at [00:57:14] specific genes and how they function. [00:57:16] So we have a neck product, for [00:57:18] example, that specifically has an ingredient [00:57:20] called quail, which is a top of [00:57:22] sugar complex that [00:57:24] only acts on 10 different [00:57:26] hydration, um, genes.
Okay. [00:57:28] Upregulates them. You don't [00:57:30] need this in any other [00:57:32] product that you would use. [00:57:34] I would argue not everyone even needs it at [00:57:36] all. Okay? Okay. But what you [00:57:38] would need definitely is [00:57:40] sperming or NAD precursors [00:57:42] or, um, [00:57:44] a, a [00:57:46] ferment of a [00:57:48] bacteria that would [00:57:50] protect your, your, your [00:57:52] proteins from the onslaught of the [00:57:54] environment, which we've talked about.
Ectomy,
Dave: no. [00:57:56] I get a little confused 'cause there's a [00:57:58] whole bunch of products, right? Yep. [00:58:00] So you have a lytic kind like [00:58:02] quality of lytic. You take it two days a month. Yes. So [00:58:04] how often with Young Goose for your [00:58:06] topical lytic is this Like once a week? Once every [00:58:08] couple days.
Amitay: So I recommend going through a [00:58:10] bottle just to make things easy [00:58:12] on people.
Okay. And have a fresh [00:58:14] product as well. Okay. Which is important. I [00:58:16] recommend going through a bottle. It's gonna take you about a [00:58:18] month or 45 days [00:58:20] and then not using again for six [00:58:22] months.
Dave: Okay. You'd make more money [00:58:24] if you had to use it all the time, but you're just being [00:58:26] honest.
Amitay: I would've made [00:58:28] much more money if I didn't speak at all.
[00:58:30] How about that? Yeah, there
Dave: you go. Tell [00:58:32] people what works. Uh, [00:58:34] at the right doses. It's the only ethical [00:58:36] thing to do. Yeah. And [00:58:38] if they get results, I believe people are [00:58:40] smart enough to come back. Mm-hmm. You know, even if [00:58:42] young Goose is not the cheapest product out there, you can get [00:58:44] some whatever oil of alay or something, it [00:58:46] just doesn't work.
So the [00:58:48] difference is, is noticeable. Yeah. [00:58:50] So kind of walk me through thus [00:58:52] stack. Mm-hmm. So if I'm all right, [00:58:54] you've dropped tons of ingredients. [00:58:56] What is the [00:58:58] combination like? What do I put on when?
Amitay: [00:59:00] Okay. So I'll go with a very [00:59:02] basic stack. Okay. And then I [00:59:04] will go with the real [00:59:06] biohacker kind of stack. Okay.
So the basic stack [00:59:08] is we have a [00:59:10] cleanser that [00:59:12] you, you need to tell me if to if, if I could [00:59:14] just name the, the [00:59:16] enzyme and if it would make a difference in [00:59:18] people's ears. So it eliminates [00:59:20] CD 38.
Dave: Okay, [00:59:22] so, so longtime [00:59:24] listeners have heard me talk about CD [00:59:26] 38. If you take NAD, [00:59:28] it increases CD 38, which is [00:59:30] pro-inflammatory.
So you have to block CD [00:59:32] 38. So your cleanser blocks this [00:59:34] pro-inflammatory side effect of high NAD.
Amitay: [00:59:36] Correct. Okay. And also, by the way, CD 38, I [00:59:38] call it NAD Pacman. The [00:59:40] reason to begin with [00:59:42] that, it interacts with [00:59:44] NAD. It's, it has crazy high [00:59:46] affinity to NAD. So if you have a lot of it [00:59:48] naturally, maybe by the way, e coli [00:59:50] from, you know, leafy greens or [00:59:52] however you got e coli into your [00:59:54] maybe hummus, how you got it into your [00:59:56] system raises significantly.
CD [00:59:58] 38. So if you have high CD 38, it [01:00:00] begets the fact that you have low [01:00:02] NAD. So by eliminating [01:00:04] CD 38. We're doing two [01:00:06] things. We're covering our, our behinds [01:00:08] in two cases. First of all, we want to have more [01:00:10] NAD, so we want to eliminate that. [01:00:12] On the other hand, because we're giving you more [01:00:14] NAD, we really win.
Wanna make sure that you [01:00:16] don't have enough, well, you don't have a lot of CD [01:00:18] 38.
Dave: Okay. So I use the cleanser [01:00:20] first. I do the second.
Amitay: [01:00:22] Then if you wanted [01:00:24] specifically to in, uh, well, let's talk [01:00:26] about basic. Basic. You use a [01:00:28] youth reset serum, [01:00:30] okay. Which is a serum that [01:00:32] drives extremely, deeply [01:00:34] all of those ingredients that we [01:00:36] mentioned before.
Anything from OID to sperm, [01:00:38] dine to NAD precursors, the ability to [01:00:40] recycle NAD copper [01:00:42] peptides, ergo [01:00:44] thine THDA. And it's
Dave: a pretty broad [01:00:46] spectrum. Yes. Okay, so I'm gonna wash [01:00:48] my face with the CD 38 blocking [01:00:50] thing. Yeah. And then I'm gonna add the serum.
Amitay: Yeah. [01:00:52] Amplifying, uh uh, sorry. Uh, [01:00:54] our cleanser is called, um, adaptogenic [01:00:56] Cleanser.
Then we're gonna use the re, [01:00:58] the U three Reset Serum Youth [01:01:00] Daily moisturizer. As I [01:01:02] mentioned before, a lot of those [01:01:04] ingredients, you actually don't [01:01:06] necessarily want them [01:01:08] to completely bypass your skin barrier [01:01:10] or to bypass the [01:01:12] stratum corneum, which is like the, the, the [01:01:14] top most layer of your skin. Okay? [01:01:16] So what a mo good [01:01:18] moisturizer would do is not [01:01:20] necessarily provide hydration to your skin, by the way [01:01:22] it is, products don't [01:01:24] really do that.
Mm-hmm. You cannot [01:01:26] provide hydration to the skin, period. [01:01:28] That's not where hydration is being [01:01:30] supplied to begin with. It's, that's from your [01:01:32] bloodstream. But what you can do [01:01:34] is block a lot of hydration, [01:01:36] exiting your skin. So seal the [01:01:38] barrier you get. Let's try. So trans epidermal [01:01:40] water loss. Okay. Um, [01:01:42] so. We wanna do that, [01:01:44] but we also want to provide those [01:01:46] NAD precursor, sperming, all of those things [01:01:48] to top layers of the skin to make sure that [01:01:50] you have a strong skin barrier, [01:01:52] strong structure on top of your [01:01:54] skin, which provides also a [01:01:56] robust protection Okay.
For your skin.
Dave: So now I've [01:01:58] got cleanser, I've got [01:02:00] serum, and then I've got moisturizer. And I [01:02:02] do that in the morning. You do, you do [01:02:04] it in the morning. Yeah. And
Amitay: what about this ladder [01:02:06] stuff you talked about? Ladder is only [01:02:08] when you do red light therapy. Okay. Or [01:02:10] if someone is just, you know, I don't wanna [01:02:12] bother using red light therapy, you could use that as your [01:02:14] serum because it's gonna be activated to some [01:02:16] extent by the, by the light of the sun.
[01:02:18] Okay. And then [01:02:20] hopefully, uh, you use BioShield [01:02:22] SPF 40, which is our sunblock [01:02:24] that also protects against these other [01:02:26] en environmental factors. Okay. [01:02:28] Blue light, EMF, et cetera. [01:02:30] That's in the morning. If you were [01:02:32] very really in a rush, you know what. [01:02:34] Just use, use, [01:02:36] use daily, the moisturizer and [01:02:38] get out of the house or don't even wash your face in the [01:02:40] morning like I do.
Dave: Is it okay to just mix all [01:02:42] this, not the C cleanser, but to just mix everything in my hand [01:02:44] and smeared on? Correct. I find it [01:02:46] really irritating to have to mix like six things one [01:02:48] at a time. Okay. Yes.
Amitay: [01:02:50] So, you mentioned before that you don't [01:02:52] only use Young Goose and I think it's [01:02:54] really cool. Again, I can [01:02:56] make more money if I don't speak, but [01:02:58] uh, I think [01:03:00] when we designed our products, we [01:03:02] designed them with the understanding that we want [01:03:04] to allow you to use other products.
There are [01:03:06] other companies that say, Hey, don't use. [01:03:08] Products before you [01:03:10] use my product. Or wait 30 [01:03:12] minutes before the Yeah. E
Dave: everyone's gonna say [01:03:14] that if they're just acting [01:03:16] commercially. My biohacker mind, it's [01:03:18] like, you know what, there's a, a peptide [01:03:20] and I'm actually gonna say it. It it [01:03:22] like the one skin.
Oh, it's one. It's a great [01:03:24] peptide. It, it has clinical [01:03:26] studies. I have no issues with putting [01:03:28] that on and using Young Goose. Mm-hmm. In fact, I think [01:03:30] it's a really good idea.
Amitay: Shout out to [01:03:32] once again. Yeah. Uh, by the way, you, since [01:03:34] it's a moisturizer, you would wanna maybe [01:03:36] use it after it's like 30 [01:03:38] minutes after.
No, no, no. It's, [01:03:40] it's a cream base. Yeah. So [01:03:42] you don't want to use it before serums. [01:03:44] Right. Because it's actually cream [01:03:46] bases in general, in [01:03:48] general are designed to be [01:03:50] Stay more on the top of this skin. Yeah.
Dave: They're gonna [01:03:52] stop the serum from penetration. So serum first, the next.
Amitay: [01:03:54] Yes. Uh, so, [01:03:56] but serums in general, because [01:03:58] we have the lytic serum, we have U three [01:04:00] set serum.
We have a serum for [01:04:02] specifically to fix hydration [01:04:04] or for pigmentation or things like [01:04:06] that. Me if I'm [01:04:08] going through something. 'cause I have melasma. So if [01:04:10] I were was in Jiujitsu, I got cut in [01:04:12] my face and now I look like, [01:04:14] uh, like a zebra. [01:04:16] I'm gonna mix a few serums in my hands, [01:04:18] apply them together on my face.
Okay. My [01:04:20] moisturizer and the BioShield SPF [01:04:22] 40, I mix them together. So yes, you could [01:04:24] definitely do that In the [01:04:26] evening I'll give you, uh, something cool to, [01:04:28] to kind of propagate. 'cause we [01:04:30] talked about sleep and the importance of sleep. [01:04:32] Your body [01:04:34] is much better at creating [01:04:36] collagen during sleep between [01:04:38] 10 to to midnight.[01:04:40]
Mm. So if you are specifically [01:04:42] interested in skin health, you [01:04:44] should be asleep at that time.
Dave: Okay. [01:04:46] Beautiful.
Amitay: Yeah. So in [01:04:48] the evening, this [01:04:50] protocol is very similar, [01:04:52] but instead of, uh, you could [01:04:54] use more serums. Mm-hmm. That's number one. You [01:04:56] could use an essence before the serums. That's [01:04:58] called amplifying essence.
And [01:05:00] that is a [01:05:02] crazy hydration. [01:05:04] Multiplier. So it actually [01:05:06] helps your body create much more [01:05:08] hydration. Express alur acid [01:05:10] genes, as an example, has much [01:05:12] more ect. Mm-hmm. Um, [01:05:14] because we don't have other [01:05:16] actives there, so we can put more ECT [01:05:18] there. And at the end of [01:05:20] your routine, the [01:05:22] product that kind of made us famous to [01:05:24] begin with, it's called the hyperbaric mask.[01:05:26]
It's a gel that you apply [01:05:28] after your moisturizer. You leave it [01:05:30] overnight, and it activates the same [01:05:32] pathways that were would've been activated if you [01:05:34] were in a red light there, if you were in a [01:05:36] hyperbaric chamber. Wow. It doesn't, [01:05:38] that's so cool. It doesn't push more [01:05:40] oxygen to the skin. It doesn't, [01:05:42] um, [01:05:44] which is a negative, by the way.
You don't [01:05:46] want a lot of oxygen applied to the skin. [01:05:48] But what it does, it activates [01:05:50] all of the pathways. NRF two, [01:05:52] CER two, and [01:05:54] um, a few other ones. [01:05:56] But it also [01:05:58] helps your mitochondria. [01:06:00] Metabolize oxygen better or [01:06:02] utilize oxygen better [01:06:04] because as we grow older, it [01:06:06] costs more energy to create [01:06:08] energy. So we lower the [01:06:10] cost of energy to create [01:06:12] energy.
Dave: I tell you guys are [01:06:14] doing some incredibly [01:06:16] high-end things around skincare at Young [01:06:18] Goose and um, if you're [01:06:20] listening to the show right now, it. [01:06:22] This guy knows what he is talking [01:06:24] about. Like the the cutting [01:06:26] edge longevity molecules that most [01:06:28] listeners have heard about. Because I've done deep [01:06:30] podcasts, multiple ones on most of the [01:06:32] compounds you've talked about, and you have some new ones I [01:06:34] haven't heard of, which is pretty unusual.[01:06:36]
So there are, [01:06:38] there are people who are just masters [01:06:40] of an area of biohacking who are going [01:06:42] deep and making things you could have made 10 years ago. [01:06:44] 'cause we didn't have the science, we didn't have the abilities. [01:06:46] So this is something that I [01:06:48] use and you can [01:06:50] tell when you talk to a founder of a company, [01:06:52] like are they real?[01:06:54]
And my job is to curate [01:06:56] people who are real and who [01:06:58] are studied and knowledgeable. So you can [01:07:00] learn what works and you can decide, look, this [01:07:02] belongs to my stack or it doesn't. Right. [01:07:04] To the extent even of saying, you know, [01:07:06] Hey, it's okay to use other stuff with my [01:07:08] product, my experience with you over the, the [01:07:10] many years, it's like you just want people to be healthy.[01:07:12]
Mm-hmm. Right. Via any means [01:07:14] necessary, yours or another. And, and I share [01:07:16] that, right? And you never have to drink [01:07:18] danger coffee. You never have to buy a young [01:07:20] goose. But if you do, you [01:07:22] might like what happens. Right? And [01:07:24] that's, that's the, the bottom line. And you [01:07:26] should know why and you judge for [01:07:28] yourself, you know, was there a lot of [01:07:30] science that's valid and relevant and useful?[01:07:32]
There is, and I [01:07:34] don't, I. Know of [01:07:36] anything out there that I could put on my skin that has [01:07:38] the broad spectrum number of [01:07:40] ingredients you do as well [01:07:42] as the science behind them. [01:07:44] So like you said, this is kind of like the quality [01:07:46] of skincare and [01:07:48] Young Goose has [01:07:50] improved so dramatically since that first [01:07:52] stuff that I tried years ago, which did [01:07:54] work.
You could see it after a week, and [01:07:56] it's just a whole nother [01:07:58] level, a whole order of magnitude above. So thanks [01:08:00] for making good stuff, continuously improving it and [01:08:02] talking about the science. I genuinely appreciate you [01:08:04] coming out. Thank you, and I'll see you at the [01:08:06] Biohacking Conference, sir. And as usual, [01:08:08] guys, you know that people come on the show to [01:08:10] talk about their creations.
They offer [01:08:12] you a discount, so go to young [01:08:14] goose.com, use code Dave 10 [01:08:16] and they'll give you 10% off. And [01:08:18] pick a product and try it. And [01:08:20] there's a full explanation on young goose.com [01:08:22] telling you what each one does, [01:08:24] or get the whole bundle with all the cool stuff that I [01:08:26] use. See you next [01:08:28] time on the Human [01:08:30] Upgrade [01:08:32] [01:08:34] Podcast.